USA Gasoline “Heat Map”

Here’s a static example for today:

Gas Map 23 April 2013

Gas Map 23 April 2013

You can get a live / current map here:

http://www.gasbuddy.com/gb_gastemperaturemap.aspx

And a Canadian map:

http://www.gasbuddy.com/gb_can_gastemperaturemap.aspx

I’m in that dark red blob of California where we are dancing with $4 gasoline… I note longingly that some folks are a good 25% lower price than here (or we are 1/3 more than there).

In a sane gasoline market, such extreme disparity would not exist, and certainly not with nice clean lines at state borders…

Looks like “Bible Belt” and “Corn Belt” are the places to go on vacation, including up into Wyoming and Montana. Forget Vegas and head on down to the Gulf Coast and Jersey Shore casinos. Avoid Chicago, and head on down to Nashville.

Interesting perspective on things… Looks like folks in Texas can cook on cheaper gasoline in their camp stoves, and get electricity at 1/3 to 1/4 the price here in California. Heck, with a situation like that, a guy might be able to afford making a living…

You can zoom in the live map and eventually it shows prices for each station. They also have a list of average prices at selected cities around the nation.

Lowest(by State and by City):

South Carolina 3.224
Oklahoma 3.243
Arkansas 3.265
New Jersey 3.265
Tennessee 3.271

Greenville, SC 3.150
Lubbock, TX 3.163
Tulsa, OK 3.164
Spartanburg, SC 3.174
Kansas City, MO 3.198

And notice how many California cities are in the highest:

Michigan 3.791
California 3.909
Illinois 3.911
Alaska 3.945
Hawaii 4.352

Sacramento, CA 3.813
Grand Rapids, MI 3.833
Flint, MI 3.843
Anchorage, AK 3.845
Chico, CA 3.848
San Bernardino, CA 3.881
Fresno, CA 3.890
Riverside, CA 3.891
Orange County, CA 3.891
Bakersfield, CA 3.898
San Diego, CA 3.904
Salinas, CA 3.907
San Jose, CA 3.912
Oakland, CA 3.912
Gary, IN 3.930
Los Angeles, CA 3.937
Ventura, CA 3.942
San Francisco, CA 4.043
Santa Barbara, CA 4.085
Chicago, IL 4.171
Honolulu, HI 4.276

I know, I know… Even though I’m in that $4 area near San Francisco, not a lot of sympathy from you folks in the EU or Australia or the UK. Or heck, even the folks in Hawaii.

Those prices are expected to rise as we have a new Cap’n Tax here in our State…

We also get to pay sales tax of about 10% on the gas tax that’s included in the price. Yes, taxing a tax… Oh Joy.

But just to put some context on it, here’s a 10 year chart from the same folks:

USA 10 year gasoline prices

USA 10 year gasoline prices

I liked it a lot more back at $2 / gallon…

IMHO, gasoline at $4 / gallon (or $3 in the “Heartland”) is a significant part of the economic ‘malaise’. Take a vacation where a drive to L.A. and back is about 800 miles? At even 40 mpg that’s 20 gallons or $80. Something that folks did just to go to L.A. for a weekend is just not going to be done at all. Why drive to L.A. to see Disneyland and be out over $240 just for the drive, overnight hotel, and ticket for one person? I can get a laptop for that much at Amazon… And if my car is a 20 mpg ‘work truck’ that blows out to $160. Just for the gas.

Believe it or not, folks used to “bomb down to L.A.” as a day trip. Not even worth thinking about now. Same thing for the “run to Reno” or Vegas. Take a drive up to the mountains for a bit of hiking in the woods? At $40 to get there and now with a variety of fees (where our parks were once ‘free’ as we already paid for them in our taxes) that’s lost a lot of interest too.

Essentially, it look like we are being priced out of economic activity. As that happens, the economy slows. Normally, one would expect a recovery as that slowdown pushed prices back to reasonable levels. As things stand now, we get prices held up by government money printing and spending, while the tax revenues drop, so they raise tax rates. Spiral decent into hell follows.

Oh Well…

Texas is looking a whole lot more interesting these days…

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About E.M.Smith

A technical managerial sort interested in things from Stonehenge to computer science. My present "hot buttons' are the mythology of Climate Change and ancient metrology; but things change...
This entry was posted in Economics - Trading - and Money, Energy and tagged , , . Bookmark the permalink.

23 Responses to USA Gasoline “Heat Map”

  1. Zeke says:

    “Looks like folks in Texas can cook on cheaper gasoline in their camp stoves, and get electricity at 1/3 to 1/4 the price here in California. Heck, with a situation like that, a guy might be able to afford making a living…”

    The last time I checked, houses on 5 acres with all of the outbuildings, and fencing, are going for very reasonable prices – compared to ours on the left coast. The land is level too.

  2. Bloke down the pub says:

    Here in the UK I just paid £ 1.36 per litre. That too includes value added tax on top of the fuel duty. Good job that most places I want to go to are within walking distance.
    OT but I was away camping at the weekend. The only stove I took with me was a home made penny stove that I got the design for after following links from this site. It worked well so, thanks for that.

  3. Gail Combs says:

    When fuel prices were ~ $1.50/gal ten years ago corn and animal feed prices were ~$2.50/50lb hay and ~ $3.50/50lb of animal grain. Now the last price I paid was $13.99.

    Minimum wage in the USA went from $5.15 (1997) to $7.25 (2009) However thanks to H1B visas many of the high paying high tech jobs have been replaced with much lower paid foreign (Chinese and Indian) workers. My husband tech writing contract jobs dropped from $60-70/hr down to $20/hr. Construction workers at least in my area have been displaced by lower paid Latinos.

    Shadow Statistics shows the USA has had a slowly increasing unemployment rate of around 23% since Obummer took office in 2009 (and Bernanke doubled the money supply)

    When Obama talks of ‘New Jobs’ I wonder how many are going to non-American citizens….. and now they want to add 11 million illegals instead of booting them out of the country.

    Darn it, if they want these extra workers in the country bring them in via normal immigration procedures by upping of immigration quotes, do the background checks, disease and drug testing, MAKE THEM LEARN ENGLISH and make sure they get their citizenship within set period of times or toss them back out. What is so difficult with common sense measures like that?

  4. philjourdan says:

    Driving from Virginia to Florida (to see my mother), I noticed the best prices were indeed in South Carolina, and that for the most part, North Carolina and Virginia were about the same. Florida does not look too bad, but my mother carps about the prices there all the time.

    Wyoming seems to be the best place to buy.

  5. mkelly says:

    The gasoline here in UP of Michigan has gone up over $0.20 in two weeks from $3.66. Cannot figure out why with oil dropping in price.

  6. Judy F. says:

    EM

    Gas prices have dropped since I took my trip, but this is what I found last month.

    I left eastern Colorado on March 12 and drove to Southern California via I-70 and I-15. Some of the prices on my trip: Arvada, CO $3.38/gal; Grand Junction, CO $3.59/gal; Cedar City, UT $3.49/gal; Pimm, NV $4.25/gal. In Southern Calif I paid $4.26, but the price dropped a week later to $4.15/gal. I then drove up the coast towards the Bay area and paid $4.15 in Arroyo Grande, CA and I paid $3.88/gal in Placerville, CA. After I started driving east on I-80 I paid $3.65 in Winnemucca, NV; $3.47 in Wendover, NV; $3.35 in Evanston, WY and $3.29/gal in Rawlins, WY. I saw gas for as low as $3.23/gal just past Rawlins, but since I had just filled up a few miles back I didn’t get gas there. Once I left Laramie, WY the prices started climbing again.

    That makes a difference in the prices I saw of $1.03/gallon and a diffence in what I paid of $.97/gallon. It sure made a difference when I filled up my tank. Now, I know that in some places I probably paid a little more because I didn’t venture too far off the main road. In some places you fill up no matter what because of the distances between here and there. It is always disconcerting to see the sign that reads ” No Services Next 140 Miles”.

    After I drove all those miles I came to the conclusion that anyone who wants to President of the US should get on I-80 and drive the full length of that Interstate, in order to fully appreciate the differences in geography, distances and lifestyles of Americans. These presidential wannabes should drive themselves, not ride in a bus, in order to appreciate the geography and people of flyover country. So much of the West is very sparsely populated. I have driven these roads a number of times and each time I am overwhelmed with the beauty of the landscape and the endurance of those who live there. Like I told a friend one time, I see presidential candidates with their suits on and their sleeves rolled up ( to indicate how hard they are willing to work for Americans) giving speeches to hard working people who probably don’t even own a suit.

  7. E.M.Smith says:

    @Judy F:

    Nice list of prices. Gives a clear picture. FWIW, checking ‘close up maps’ from that site prior to a trip can save a decent amount of money by identifying cheaper ‘away from the road’ stations in advance. I’ve usually found, though, that just hitting the major Truck Stops gets me most of the advantage. Love’s, Pietro, Flying J, etc.

    I’ve gotten pretty good at ‘gas planning’ and they all hand out free maps of their stations. There’s a Pietro? just over the bridge at the California / Arizona border on I-10? that’s a load cheaper than the California prices. I arrive ‘on fumes’ from the last F.J. fillup (somewhere around Palm Springs) from the California side. Going the other way, it’s a mandatory “stop and fill” whatever the gauge says. About Texas I swap over to Love’s.

    Any time I head out for the other side, I’ll pick up maps at the truck stops (if the ones in the car are over 2 years old). Most of the time I’ll do some computer based gas price checks. I prefer to take the Diesel as it gets 450 miles on a tank of ‘gas’. More choices on where to fill… 7 fillups coast to coast. Can usually ‘get by’ with only one ( taking I-80) or 2 (through So.Cal) fillups in California even though I’m starting at the far coastal edge and in the middle. (I-80 in snow is not, um, ‘efficient’ ;-)

    Maybe that’s my “problem”… I’ve made that drive dozens of times…

    Now that you mention it, I own a suit, but it last fit me in about 1975…
    ;-)

    I’d also suggest that anyone wanting to be president be given 2 months working minimum wage at a burger counter and paying ALL their own expenses for that 2 months out of their pay check… including rent on their studio apartment and payment on the used Ford they drive to work…

    Maybe a “live in our shoes” program where any presidential ‘wanna be’ has to spend a year of 6 scenarios. 2 months flipping burgers, 2 months driving cross country (on set small budget), 2 months looking at the south end of a north bound horse on a farm, 2 months roofing houses in the summer, 2 months … Issue them a used camper (one bed) to live in for the duration and they cook their own meals…

    “Presidential Peace Corps” anyone?

    @Mkelly:

    The crack spread widens in response to all sorts of things. So oil can be dropping, but right now the refiners are turning facilities from making heating oil to making gasoline, so some are shut down and getting maintenance. Typically that makes a small shortage of product ahead of ‘driving season’ as folks head out on vacations.

    Don’t know that that is the ‘issue’, but it usually is this time of year. Also a lot of rain and flooding up your way, so could just be local refining / barges having some issues with water…

    @PhilJourdan:

    Florida has higher gasoline taxes to get their tax revenues from the tourists. I always fill up just outside the Florida border as it jumps 10 ¢ to 20 ¢ at the border just from that.

    I’ve come to the conclusion that anyone regularly driving cross country would benefit from a very large aux gas tank and using a site like Gas Buddy to know where to gas up. (Heck, I find 25 ¢ differences just on the local map).

    A friend had a VW Diesel once that got 800 miles on a tank. He’d fill up in Utah and make it all the way back here. Tank was sized for the gasoline option and they didn’t bother changing it for the Diesel ;-) I’ve thought of ‘doing the math’ on added drag of a ‘roof carrier’ add on tank vs saved per gallon prices; but just not cared enough to figure it out ;-)

  8. R. de Haan says:

    Everything you need to know about spare gas cans: http://www.peakprosperity.com/forum/gas-cans-no-good-bad-and-ugly/53453 The idea is to stock up when the prices are down and burn the stuff when the prices are up. Good gas cans, preferably plastic for reduced weight could provide a solution. At home I have installed a 100 gallon squire pallet container made from a strong polyethylene. I can load it on a trailer to fill it up. I secured the container with an aluminium mesh called explocontrol or technokontrol. see technokontrol.com to prevent fuel vapors from igniting and evaporation of the fuel. I have the same stuff used to secure the gasoline tanks of the cars and the aircraft to keep everything safe. http://www.technokontrol.com/en/products/fuel-cans.php

  9. R. de Haan says:

    Here in Germany the price of 95 octane car gasoline at the pump was euro 1,64 per liter yesterday. This makes euro 7.38 per gallon (x 4.5). In us dollar the price is 7.38 x 1.3 = USD 9.58 which makes gasoline in Germany almost three times more expensive compared to the US. It doesn’t take rocket science to explain why Europe is going down the drain, does it.

  10. R. de Haan says:

    OT but worth a read, James Dellingpole telling how Europe has been the laboratory of green policies but the cavia has died. If this will bring down fuel prices, I don’t think so but I do think the entire system is going to collapse soon: http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/100212713/time-to-shoot-the-husky-dave/

  11. R. de Haan says:

    Unfortunately Obama is still set to hike US fuel prices at the same level of those in Europe: http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2013/apr/25/obama-for-america-shame-climate-sceptics

    What are you all waiting for, Just kick the hack out of office…

  12. Espen says:

    Bloke down the pub says:
    24 April 2013 at 10:02 am
    Here in the UK I just paid £ 1.36 per litre.

    We pay almost exactly the same here in Norway. And that’s almost exactly twice that cheap Californian fuel…

  13. Jason Calley says:

    @ R. de Haan “What are you all waiting for, Just kick the hack out of office…”

    That is one of the greatest problems with the American political system. We CAN’T kick him out. There are no recall provisions for Federal office holders. Yes, in theory, the House of Representatives can impeach the President, and then the Senate has to try the case — but We The People have no say in the process. Once you get a majority of crooks in office, the system will never police itself. And once you get the President looking through FBI files to uncover dirt on his lesser cronies, then it becomes even more unlikely that a President will be removed. Ah, but the Judicial Branch will save the common man! Uh, no…The judges in the courts are appointed by the criminal politicians, and when a case comes before them that threatens the politicians who chose them, well, the case gets thrown out on some imagined technicality.

    Our leaders are sociopaths with no conscience. They do not fear the law. They do not have a sense of ethics. The do not have any shame of their actions. They do not have empathy for their victims. They are very well armed. There are no pleasant solutions..

  14. Espen says:

    Jason Calley says:
    26 April 2013 at 11:59 am
    Our leaders are sociopaths with no conscience.

    Well, why would anyone become a politician if they didn’t have a dangerous urge to control other people?

    But be careful what you ask for. In times like these, it’s important to remember that while our democracies are full of flaws, it’s actually the best government form ever tried and found working. One should of course keep the eyes wide open – an open democratic state can transform rather silently into a fascist or communist state. But on the other hand, one should also keep in mind that it’s not perfect, and it will never become perfect. Instead it’s like a child that needs a lot of care, love and tending, even it’s hard to love such an ugly and bad-mannered child.

  15. Gail Combs says:

    Jason Calley says:
    26 April 2013 at 11:59 am

    @ R. de Haan “What are you all waiting for, Just kick the hack out of office…”

    That is one of the greatest problems with the American political system. We CAN’T kick him out…..
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.
    Yeah they have us covered six ways to a dozen. If you think of the political system as ‘Legalized Robbery’ then you see even the Supreme Court is in on the scam.

    Jurorists have the right and duty to judge not only the case but the law itself. We as Jurorists CAN set aside laws passed by Congress. This is the ultimate power of the people over the government and the powerful want to keep it well buried. This is why we now have to deal with ‘Regulations’ instead of ‘laws’. It is a way of getting around the power given to the people by the Constitution and Amendments. The Constitution gives us the right to a trial by jury but the Supreme Court has slowly limited it over time.

    First Jurors are not told what their rights and duties are. See my other comment link and read the stuff from the Fully Informed Jury Association

    Second our right to a jury trial in civil and criminal cases has been removed and replaced by determination by a bureaucrat or police officer. Regulations are written by bureaucrats and are NOT voted on by our representatives and those regulations are then enforced without trial.

    Just look at Civil Asset Forfeiture.

    Civil Asset forfeiture has allowed police to view all of America as some giant national K-Mart, where prices are not just lower, but non-existent — a sort of law enforcement ‘pick-and-don’t-pay.‘” —U.S. Representative Henry Hyde,

    Incredible as it sounds, civil asset forfeiture laws allow the government to seize property without charging anyone with a crime… the government was allowed to keep whatever property it seized without ever having to prove a case. Seized property was presumed guilty and could be forfeited based upon mere hearsay—even a tip supplied by by an informant who stood to gain up to 25% of the forfeited assets. Owners were forced into the untenable situation of trying to prove a negative—that something never happened, even though no proof of any illegal act had been offered at trial….
    Eighty percent of property forfeited to the US during the previous decade was seized from owners who were never even charged with a crime! Over $7 billion has been forfeited to the federal government since 1985….

    Even a false statement on a loan application can trigger forfeiture. Physicians are subject to forfeiture of their entire assets based on a clerical errors in medicare billing. The government even tried to forfeit a farmer’s tractor for allegedly running over an endangered rat…..
    http://www.fear.org/

    Here is a couple of recent examples:

    Obama has the Dept. of Justice going after small farmers under the post-911 “Bank Secrecy Act” which makes it a crime to deposit less than $10,000 when you earned more than that.

    “The level we deposited was what it was and it was about the same every week,” Randy Sowers told Frederick News. The Sowers own and run South Mountain Creamery in Middletown, Maryland.

    Admittedly, when the Sowers earned over $10,000 in February, and learned they’d have to fill out paperwork at the bank for such large deposits, they simply rolled the deposits over to keep them below the none-of-your-f***ing-business amount, rather than waste time on bureaucratic red tape aimed at flagging terrorism or other illegal activities….

    “Structuring,” explains Overlawyered.com, “is the federal criminal offense of splitting up bank deposits so as to keep them under a threshold such as $10,000 above which banks have to report transactions to the government. ”While being questioned, the Sowers were finally presented with a seizure order and advised that the feds had already emptied their bank account of $70,000. The Dept. of Justice has since sued to keep $63,000 of the Sowers’ money, though they committed no crime other than maintaining their privacy.

    Without funds, they will be unable to make purchases for the spring planting.

    When a similar action was taken against Taylor’s Produce Stand last year, the feds seized $90,000, dropped the charges and kept $45,000 of the stand’s money.
    http://lewrockwell.com/rep3/feds-seize-farmer-bank-accounts.html

    So they split up their deposits so they could avoid the governments nose up their behind. This is an action most buzy small business people who are just vaguely familiar with the law might take. Heck it is something I would do if I ever managed to get a bunch of checks adding up to $10,000. A jury trial by an informed jury would have looked at the whole picture given them a slap on the wrist or tossed it out. Instead the money hungry government took the money and ran without bothering with the complications and expense of a trial. Were these people anywhere close to money laundering for terrorists or drug lords which was the INTENT of the law? NO. Was justice served? NO. But the US government made a nice haul with little work, a bureaucrat gets to expand their domain and increase their grade. A Win-Win for government and a big lose for justice.
    ….

    Here is a bit of the information from my other comment with additions and thoughts.

    U.S. Constitution – Article 3 Section 2

    The judicial Power shall extend to all Cases, in Law and Equity, arising under this Constitution, the Laws of the United States, and Treaties made, or which shall be made, under their Authority
    http://www.usconstitution.net/xconst_A3Sec2.html

    Think about that. Bureaucracy is under the PRESIDENT, the Executive and not the Judicial branch so right their the whole trial by bureaucrat is unconstitutional.

    Annotation 23 – Article III

    Clause 3. Trial by Jury

    Clause 3. The Trial of all Crimes, except in Cases of Impeachment, shall be by Jury; and such Trial shall be held in the State where the said Crimes shall have been committed; but when not committed within any State, the Trial shall be at such Place or Places as the Congress may by Law have directed.
    Footnote 1282] See the Sixth Amendment.

    U.S. Constitution – Amendment 6
    Amendment 6 – Right to Speedy Trial, Confrontation of Witnesses

    In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence.
    http://constitution.findlaw.com/article3/article.html

    Again that is pretty darn clear. But lets make it real clear

    regulatory offense legal definition

    noun
    A crime that is not inherently wrong, but that is illegal because it is prohibited by legislation. Some examples of regulatory offenses are exceeding the speed limit; public intoxication; and hunting, fishing, or driving without the appropriate license. Also known as a statutory offense. See also crime.
    Webster’s New World Law Dictionary http://law.yourdictionary.com/regulatory-offense

    And here is the I gottcha

    crime legal definition

    noun
    An act or omission that violates the law and is punishable by a sentence of incarceration.

    statutory crime
    An offense that was not a crime under the common law, but has been made a crime by a statute.
    Broadly, any crime that is defined by a statute. See also common-law crime…..
    http://law.yourdictionary.com/crime

    BUT the tramplers of the US Constitution went to work again

    The Seventh Amendment, passed by the First Congress without debate, cured the omission by declaring that the right to a jury trial shall be preserved in common-law cases, thus leaving the traditional distinction between cases at law and those in equity or admiralty, where there normally was no jury. The implied distinction parallels the explicit division of federal judicial authority in Article III to cases (1) in law, (2) in equity, and (3) in admiralty and maritime jurisdiction. The contemporaneously passed Judiciary Act of 1789 similarly provided that “the trial of issues of fact, in the district courts, in all causes except civil causes of admiralty and maritime jurisdiction, shall be by jury.”

    As Justice Joseph Story later explained in Parsons v. Bedford (1830): “In a just sense, the amendment then may well be construed to embrace all suits which are not of equity and admiralty jurisdiction, whatever may be the peculiar form which they may assume to settle legal rights.”

    The Supreme Court has, however, arrived at a more limited interpretation. It applies the amendment’s guarantee to the kinds of cases that “existed under the English common law when the amendment was adopted,”….
    The right to trial by jury is not constitutionally guaranteed in certain classes of civil cases that are concededly “suits at common law,” particularly when “public” or governmental rights are at issue and if one cannot find eighteenth-century precedent for jury participation in those cases. Atlas Roofing Co. v. Occupational Safety & Health Review Commission (1977). Thus, Congress can lodge personal and property claims against the United States in non-Article III courts with no jury component. In addition, where practice as it existed in 1791 “provides no clear answer,” the rule is that “[o]nly those incidents which are regarded as fundamental, as inherent in and of the essence of the system of trial by jury, are placed beyond the reach of the legislature.” Markman v. Westview Instruments (1996). In those situations, too, the Seventh Amendment does not restrain congressional choice.

    In contrast to the near-universal support for the civil jury trial in the eighteenth and early nineteenth centuries, modern jurists consider civil jury trial neither “implicit in the concept of ordered liberty,” Palko v. State of Connecticut (1937), nor “fundamental to the American scheme of justice,” Duncan v. Louisiana (1968). Accordingly, in company with only the Second Amendment and the Grand Jury Clause of the Fifth Amendment, the Seventh Amendment is not “incorporated” against the states; it applies only in the federal courts. In the federal courts, the parties can waive the right, but there is no longer a requirement, as there was in 1791, that civil juries be composed of twelve persons and must reach a unanimous verdict. Colgrove v. Battin (1973).
    http://www.heritage.org/constitution/#!/amendments/7/essays/159/right-to-jury-in-civil-cases

    The more I read the more contempt I have for the Justices in the Supreme Court who were SUPPOSED to uphold the Constitution and not the right of ‘rape by politician’.

  16. Gail Combs says:

    EM, seems my comment got booted into the ether. If you can not fish it out I have a copy.

    REPLY: I think the above one was it. “F-bomb” likely put it there. -E.M.Smith]

  17. R. de Haan says:

    Thanks for the input Jason, Gail and Espen.

    The reason why I said “kick the heck out of office” is the following.
    We all know the current debt crises is the biggest problem to be solved. At Zero Hedge the scenario was sketched that the approx. 20 trillion of debt could be compensated with a Global 30% tax on Middle- and Upper Class assets: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/muddle-through-has-failed-bcg-says-there-may-be-only-painful-ways-out-crisis

    Now if such an operation would be executed it would involve the World Bank and the UN Agenda 21, the program for sustainable development: http://www.green-agenda.com/agenda21.html
    What our overlords regard sustainable in terms of global population is something between 1 billion and 500 million inhabitants.
    With over 180 countries signed up to the contract of lunacy and Obama as cheer leader I think we have arrived at the point where everything comes down to a classic “its them or us” situation.

    To get rid of Obama and his cronies IMO has become a first priority.

  18. Zeke says:

    And what is John Kerry doing in Brussels?

  19. E.M.Smith says:

    @Zeke:

    Pretending to matter and adding to his retirement and “consolation prize for losing the presidency” fund…

    @R. de Haan:

    The problem, IMHO, is the incredible power of stupid. We’ve reached the point where the majority are stupid enough to want the Kool-Aid and the smart ones in Govt are immoral enough to want to push it. The rest of us are either irrelevant or collateral damage.

    Usually that status only resolves AFTER a major collapse causes enough folks enough pain that they once again let the smart ones run things and also give the immoral ones ‘the French Haircut’ (as it was called in The French Revolution…)

    I expect it to take decades to reach that point.

    The “30% tax” as a “solution” isn’t a solution. The ones who have the money are the same ones owed the debt… (Poor folks do not hold large debt portfolios). So taxing the wealthy to pay the bonds held by the wealthy is not a solution. It’s just a repudiation by other means. (Taxes those who didn’t buy bonds to pay off the bad bets by those who did…)

    The only solution is debt default. Real and obvious, or hidden, devious and distributed to as many uninvolved parties as possible.

    All that assumes anyone is actually thinking about a ‘solution’ and even THAT supposes that they actually want a solution… “Facts not in evidence”…

    In the end, it’s just the case that far more promises have been given than can ever be kept. So someone gets a broken promise. Put another way, take the Ketchup Company away from Kerry and give it to the US Gov’t who then sells it Kerry to pay off the bonds held by… Kerry… What changed? In the end, Kerry paid money to Kerry and the bonds went POOF! That is just repudiation. Now you can play with which parties get substituted for Kerry in the middle and Kerry with the bonds. Then it’s just a very muddy repudiation with some Socialism spreading the bankruptcy to uninvolved parties until they run out of other people’s money to spend…

    None of that kind of rearrangement of the deck chairs is a “fix” to anything. An actual “fix” involves creating enough new wealth to repay the bonds without such 3-rd party of the debt shenanigans. Nobody in government is working on creating new wealth…

    So we’re just in an ‘eat the seed corn’ process until we run out. Then, and only then, will someone start thinking about planting maybe being important…

    See the history of John Smith and the early colonies… it’s instructive and appropriate.

  20. R. de Haan says:

    River boat Kerry, just another lying dirtbag, just like Gore: http://green-agenda.com/agenda21.html

    I’m sure Kerry was in Brussels to visit NATO, a few potential subjects: The bomb attack on the French Embassy in Tripoli, the wind down of the Afghanistan Mission and the Training mission, closing shop in 2014, the developments in Syria and the increased terrors activity in Europe, Canada and the USA.

  21. PhilJourdan says:

    @Zeke – Practicing his french.

  22. E.M.Smith says:

    @R. de Haan:

    Of those who are stupid enough to answer honestly…

    FWIW: I would never answer that question in the affirmative….

    To make a bomb sufficient to take out a tank:

    Recognize that the treads are the most vulnerable point. A log tossed into the treads is the best solution. but a nice device can be made via oxidizer and reducer in various combinations mixed in a sealed container. (Details upon contract and payment in Swiss Francs in Swiss account or Caymans if you are bright ;-0 )

    FWIW, I can ‘kill a tank’ with “common household ingredients” but see no reason to share that with the world. (Think “air breather”…)

    FWIW: I’m of the opinion that it is closer to 50% who are expecting “armed revolt” to be needed. Most folks just keep their mouth shut and fume….

    At the fall of the USSR, logs of about 5 inch diameter where chucked into the treads of tanks. THEN gasoline bombs were tossed on until the occupants were “cooked out” of the tanks.

    It is remarkably easy to killl a tank… Those old methods still work.

    Anything beyond this requires that I know you. Person to person and face to face.

    Realize that I am 100% a patriot of the U.S.A. as defined by the U.S. Constitution.

    But anyone, and any external agency, that tries to subvert that Constitution and it’s original meaning “has issues”….

    Genereral Information

    Any strong oxidizer and any strong reducer, mixed, makes an explosive. There are hundreds of each… For example, one can bubble acetylene through copper salts to make an explosive that, on detonation, leaves behind copper and carbon. Not very useful to the forensic scientist…

    Similarly there are a dozen other simple explosive mixes. The ‘trick’ is not to be connected to the explosive when it goes boom! That I will not share…

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