Well, Mueller has made an indictment.
I’m not sure what to make of it, but I’m certain both “sides” (Dems and Repubs) will be claiming victory and vindication.
It’s here a a PDF file:
internet_research_agency_indictment
I’ve not read the whole thing yet. The news summaries basically say “A set of Russian guys tried to stir up trouble in general and supported Trump some, but it didn’t change anything”.
Well Duh!
The best they can do is position one of the “Oligarchs” as being close to Putin.
So let me get this straight:
A Very Very rich Russian Businessman wanted to get a Very Very rich American Businessman elected (as he thought that would be better for the interests of very very rich businessmen, one presumes) and was not fond of Hillary and her “bleed and demand payments / blackmail / bribes” to get anything done approach. I’m shocked, shocked I say to find that folks in business didn’t like Hillary and that Russians who had to cough up some large number of $Millions to get the Uranium One deal approved would not want THAT bribery machine in the White House.
Oh, and there was a general “support both sides tossing rocks at the other” element generally designed to cause discord. Like the U.S. political parties and all their hangers on needed any help in that department. /sarc;
All of it achieving… nothing.
Well, that’s God Only Knows how many $Millions spent to discover that the Russians do the same thing we do. Try to get influence in foreign countries.
Some news links to get their “spin” on things (any bold bolded by me):
First, a search on “RT Russia Indictment” found many articles. Kind of a surprise.
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=RT+Russia+indictment
So picking some from this lot will be a bit random:
13 Russians indictment reveals odd ‘meddling’ efforts — RT …
The indictment of 13 Russian nationals over alleged meddling in US elections describes methods allegedly used by the defendants. Some of them are truly strange …
[Search domain [www.rt.com]
https://www.rt.com/news/419065-russian-indictment-odd-meddling/Mueller indicted 13 Russians to drag probe out and … – rt.com
By indicting Russian nationals and entities for meddling in the 2016 US election, FBI Special Counsel Robert Mueller seeks to drag the probe out for his own gain …
[Search domain [www.rt.com]
https://www.rt.com/usa/419083-russia-probe-mueller-profit-indictment/#13Russians: Underwhelmed netizens react to US indictment …
Reactions from internet users to the underwhelming US indictment over alleged Russian collusion during the 2016 election range from … RT Question more. live. 06:12 …
[Search domain [www.rt.com]
https://www.rt.com/usa/419061-russia-indictment-trump-twitter/Mueller’s indictment of 13 Russians perfectly … – rt.com
The latest not-so-smoking gun in the ‘Mueller time’ saga – the indictment of 13 Russian nationals suspected of interfering with American democracy – comes at …
[Search domain [www.rt.com]
https://www.rt.com/usa/419101-mueller-indictment-media-cycle/
‘Absurd’ meddling claims & indictment of … – rt.com
US indictment of 13 Russian nationals and three entities over alleged meddling in American elections in 2016 has been labelled absurd by the Russian Foreign Ministry …
[Search domain [www.rt.com]
https://www.rt.com/news/419049-us-indictment-elections-russian-reaction/Rosenstein on Russian Indictment: No American was “knowing …
This is going to be a tough pill to swallow for the Trump/Russia collusion diehards. Friday, Special Counsel Robert Mueller indicted 13 Russian nationals and 3 …
Taking the underwhelmed netizens at randome:
#13Russians: Underwhelmed netizens react to US indictment over election meddling
Published time: 16 Feb, 2018 23:00Reactions from internet users to the underwhelming US indictment over alleged Russian collusion during the 2016 election range from the absurd to the laughable.
Mueller indicts 13 Russians
Following Friday’s revelation that a US federal grand jury has indicted 13 Russian nationals and three Russian entities for allegedly interfering with the US 2016 election, many thought they would finally get the answers they have been searching for.
Then has a bunch of twitter quotes. Mostly saying there’s no there there.
Alexey Kovalev
@Alexey__Kovalev
Don’t forget that most of these guys aren’t some KGB dark arts geniuses, they’re underpaid journalists from failing local news outlets with their careers going down the drain, the Internet Research Agency being the only place that would still employ them
However, the indictment from special counsel Robert Mueller includes no allegations that any of the ‘interference’ actually influenced the outcome of the election at all.
Jordan
@JordanCharitonAlready seeing Hillbots tweeting Russia “inflated” size of @SenSanders movement & it wasn’t as big as reported. I covered 40-50 rallies and events, several with 30-40k in attendance. There was nothing inflated about #FeeltheBern. Only inflation is bullshit that will now be spun
The indictment does accuse the defendants (now affectionately referred to as the #13Russians) of forming an organization known as the Internet Research Agency. A group which they say “sought, in part, to conduct what it called ‘information warfare against the United States of America’ through fictitious US personas on social media platforms and other Internet-based media.”
Carmine Sabia
@CarmineSabiaAs the reality of what has happened starts to set in on Democrats, that President Donald Trump will not be impeached or indicted and there was no collusion, it will be a bigger meltdown than Election Day.
The group is accused of “supporting the presidential campaign of then-candidate Donald J. Trump…and disparaging Hillary Clinton.” However, the indictment also found the group was established in May 2014, long before President Donald Trump announced his intention to run for office. It also states that after Trump’s inauguration, the group scheduled rallies both for and against the newly elected president.
And it goes on from there.
Then these guys popped up. Don’t knbow who they are, but they are leading with the “Nothing There” approach:
[Search domain [legalinsurrection.com]
https://legalinsurrection.com/2018/02/rosenstein-on-russian-indictment-no-american-was-knowing-participant-no-allegation-altered-the-outcome-of-the-2016-election/
Rosenstein on Russian Indictment: No American was “knowing participant,” no allegation conduct “altered the outcome of the 2016 election”
Posted by Kemberlee Kaye Friday, February 16, 2018 at 3:00pm
This is going to be a tough pill to swallow for the Trump/Russia collusion diehards.
Friday, Special Counsel Robert Mueller indicted 13 Russian nationals and 3 Russian entities for the unregistered interference in U.S. elections.
“From in or around 2014 to the present, Defendants knowingly and intentionally conspired with each other (and with persons known and unknown to the Grand Jury) to defraud the United States by impairing, obstructing, and defeating the lawful functions of the government through fraud and deceit for the purpose of interfering with the U.S. political and electoral processes, including the presidential election of 2016,” reads the indictment.
The indictment claims these individuals posed as American activists and engaged with “unwitting” US persons in order to fine-tune their strategy. Additionally, several accused individuals committed identity theft, using illegally obtained social security numbers and driver license numbers to bolster the appearance of legitimacy and to place ads on various social media platforms.
A sampling of ads placed:
So, gee, political ads are not very effective and US Media sucked down some good Russian Cash. Who knew… /sarc;
Then CNBC is certain it means Trump was “strongly supported” by the whole thing with the hint that the election must surely be tainted by this all.
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/02/16/russians-indicted-in-special-counsel-robert-muellers-probe.html
Special counsel Mueller: Russians conducted ‘information warfare’ against US during election to help Donald Trump win
Special counsel Robert Mueller said a grand jury had indicted 13 Russian nationals and three Russian entities for alleged interference in the 2016 presidential election.
The defendants allegedly conducted “information warfare” against the United States election process to help Donald Trump win.
The defendants used fake American personas, social media platforms, and other Internet media to advance their scheme, according to an indictment.Dan Mangan | Mike Calia
Published 20 Hours Ago Updated 14 Hours AgoA federal grand jury has indicted 13 Russian nationals and three Russian entities for alleged illegal interference in the 2016 presidential elections, during which they strongly supported the candidacy of Donald Trump, special counsel Robert Mueller’s office said Friday.
The indictment says that a Russian organization called the Internet Research Agency sought to wage “information warfare” against the United States and to “sow discord” in the American political system by using fictitious American personas and social media platforms and other Internet-based media.
Internet Research Agency, a so-called “troll farm” based in St. Petersburg, Russia,” was allegedly controlled by a defendant in the indictment named Yevgeny Progozhin, who is a wealthy associate of Russian President Vladimir Putin.
The indictment said the Internet Research Agency was registered with the Russian government as a corporate entity in 2013, and by May 2014 the group’s strategy included interfering with the 2016 U.S. presidential election, with the stated goal of “spread[ing] distrust towards the candidates and the political system in general,” the indictment said.
So in their view “distrust toward the candidateS and the political system in general” is “strongly supporting Trump” in their universe. OK…
Sigh. Yet more noise and smoke signifying nothing.
In the indictment itself I was surprised to see that they were aghast that people on the internet didn’t always use their true given name. Like, oh, 99% of absolutely everyone on the internet?… Unless you are a “Public Person” it is way smarter to use a “handle” than your real given name.
Then they were further shocked to find that people cared about the US election and would buy ads and promote rallies for their preferred candidate. Yes, the USA has a law saying money can only come from domestic sources. So, about those “contributions” to Madam Hillary’s “charity” from foreign sources…
The Left is certain this is just the opening salvo and Any Day Now all the Trump Advisors, Children, Trump himself, and the family pet will all be indicted for actually talking to someone with a funny accent. (Barron for talking to Mom.) While The Right is sure this is complete exoneration of all things Russia Related and in fact indicts Hillary (by indirection, somehow).
To me, it mostly looks like what Mueller has found is that Russians don’t really give a damn about USA law and do what they want. That anyone is surprised by that is the surprise.
Frankly, that the Russians may have liked Trump a little more than Hillary just tells me that have some degree of brains in their heads and know graft and corruption in Hillary when they had to pay it.
Musings from the Chiefio 
Looks like this guy has gone through it in some detail:
http://datechguyblog.com/2018/02/16/datechguy-reads-the-mueller-indictment-some-fun-facts-expect-updates/
There are currently thousands of sealed indictments out there in the court system, so this I am hoping this is just the opening salvo of a systematic reveal of organized efforts to manipulate the public discourse and influence the political process.
If that happens I don’t see how they could avoid tripping over Soros and linking him to much of this action.
Soros is Enemy #1 when it comes to subverting democracy around the world. I think we need a 3-person Special Prosecution Panel and a staff of 50 just for this one Mega-Rat.
Yeah… Actively promoting “Color Revolutions” to subvert democracies is definitive.
Gee, were the Dems advocating a Color Revolution for the USA after Trump won?…. Just sayin’…
Heh.
So Russia, with a GDP of 1.2 trillion or so, which is about 7% of USA GDP, spend thousands in a conspiracy to affect the outcome of a US election. Hmm. 0.1% of their GDP is just over a billion bucks, but they spent thousands? Less than millionth of GDP. And even then, it wasn’t all spent on supporting just one side. No surprise it didn’t affect the outcome – especially given Hillbillary spend, what, a billion?
Seems pretty inept from a foreign govt, unless a deliberate distraction – but from what?
On a lighter note, some cartoonists have seen the light:
And also this one by Rick McKee:
This indictment is just the concrete foundation course.
Grand jury considers evidence shows that:
It happened, not fake news
Russia did it using covert means
Ongoing operation since 2014
Americans helped
Left wing & right.
Some were gullible. (Those in THIS indictment)
Note the careful use of “this indictment” in official statements.
Russia organised protests.
Try sacking me now Trump
Meanwhile, unnoticed by MSM, subpoenas filled this way & that, looking at Trump et al financial dealings, extraditions of hackers & persons of interest. Mueller interviews of Bannon, Sater, Manafort etc go on quietly. To be continued
Oh and that Nunes memo, nice distraction. That nasty mr Steele.
Waiting for the Dem counter memo….
jim2 here’s my latest edition on Soros, the man behind the curtain who
works to take down US democracy.
https://beththeserf.wordpress.com/2018/02/13/50th-edition-serf-under_ground-journal/
Good article says…
“First, if Mueller’s theory is correct, three things make Steele a criminal: first, he is a foreign citizen; second, he tried to influence an election, which he received payments to do (including from the FBI itself); and third, he neither registered as a foreign agent nor listed his receipts and expenditures to the Federal Election Commission. Also, according to the FBI, along the way, Steele lied…a lot, while the dossier he disseminated contained its own lies based on bought-and-paid for smears from foreign sources reliant on rumors and innuendo.
Second, if Mueller’s theory is correct, three things make FusionGPS a criminal co-conspirator: it knew Steele was a foreign citizen; it knew, and paid, Steele to influence an election; and it knew, and facilitated, Steele neither registering as a foreign agent nor reporting his funding from the Democratic National Committee and the Clinton campaign to the Federal Election Commission.
Third, if Mueller’s theory is correct, then three things make PerkinsCoie a potential target: it knew Steele was a foreign citizen; it knew, and paid, Steele to influence an election; and it knew, and facilitated, Steele neither registering as a foreign agent nor reporting his funding from the Democratic National Committee and the Clinton campaign to the Federal Election Commission, by disguising its receipt of payments from the Clinton campaign as a “legal expense.”
Fourth, if Mueller’s theory is correct, then three things make the DNC a potential target: it knew Steele was a foreign citizen; it knew, and paid, Steele to influence an election; and it knew, and facilitated, Steele neither registering as a foreign agent nor reporting his funding from the Democratic National Committee and the Clinton campaign to the Federal Election Commission, by disguising its payments to Steele as laundered legal expenses to a law firm.
Fifth, if Mueller’s theory is correct, three things make the Clinton Campaign a potential target: it knew Steele was a foreign citizen; it knew, and paid, Steele to influence an election; and it knew, and facilitated, Steele neither registering as a foreign agent nor reporting his funding from the Clinton campaign to the Federal Election Commission, by disguising its funding of payments to Steele laundered through a law firm as a “legal expense.”
Sorry, lost the link. However there were numerous other clear foreign agents the DNC colluded with, and not just to influence an election, but to remove a sitting president, and many other areas of likely illegal use of the FISA court, and clear obstruction in not going after HRC. Oh, and Obama admin paid into the dossier apparently as well.
David A:
Hoist with their own petard?
Just for the record: https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-02-16/muellers-investigation-farce-files-joke-indictment-against-russian-trolls
David A: ” three things make Steele a criminal: first, he is a foreign citizen”
WTF? I’m glad I didn’t get arrested last time I landed in the US, I didn’t realise foreignness was a crime.
Rhoda Klapp says: 18 February 2018 at 10:49 am
I don’t think that is David A’s opinion, it is his take on Mueller’s position.
Apparently the Facebook VP of marketing had this to say about ad buys… (direct link from Trump’s tweet yesterday)
Hit to Scott Adams’ YouTube (11:26 @ 1x speed).
Crap – how’d strikeouts get in there? WTB preview and edit functionality… the Facebook dude is VP of Facebook Ads…
[Reply: Fixed it. Stray extra quote mark end of the first URL AND an S in angle brackets just after "Trump's". There was a matching close S but WP may have added it to balance the first one. If you intended STRONG use the whole word or better yet, use a 'b' for bold.-E.M.Smith]
Mueller’s long indictment doesn’t mention ANYTHING specific. I gather from other sources that the whole thing was about postings on Facebook and other social media. He didn’t give any dollar amounts either.
I wonder how that compare with the US ending the Mossadegh’s democratic government in Iran, lots of S. American countries and propping up unpleasant dictators all over the world. Isn’t “regime change” interfering with another country? I suppose Soros breaking the Bank of England by shorting sterling by $10 billion doesn’t count as interference. There is no doubt that his support of Kosovo’s independence was interfering though.
@Rhoda:
Being a “foreigner” is not a crime in the USA. Being a “foreigner” and attempting to influence an election (especially via spending money) IS a crime… unless, of course, you are an illegal alien / Dreamer and want to vote or hold street protests or contribute money to Democrats… /sarc;
@aashfield:
IIRC, there was also setting up a USA server from which to work (so IP addresses would not be flagged as Russia) and having some folks use “purloined” USA real IDs for displacing who was doing what.
The USA has a law stating no foreigner is allowed to influence an election… I have no idea if the other countries / events cited have laws saying “no dicking with us”, but they might … Then again, since when have laws slowed down the CIA overseas of the FBI at home… (Or the NSA anywhere…)
EMS.
It’s really annoying how the MSP gets so worked up about this when America does far more of it. Talk about hypocrisy.
#FreeTheRusian13
😜
(They’re all in Russia. They will never be extradited. Nobody cares because it’s a joke of an indictment anyways. If they did go to trial in the U.S., it would blow Muller’s fake ‘muh, Russia’ investigation to hell’n’gone. I’m just being a stinker with that hash tag.)
EMS.
It’s really annoying how the MSP gets so worked up about this when America does far more of it. Talk about hypocrisy.
Correction ALL countries do this, they try to manipulate the public and political process so that it aids their other state interests. It is only a question of degree and how open they are about it.
Russia / USSR have been influencing elections world wide for 100 years, nothing unusual here. The question is did they actually cross the line and pay money to elected officials and lobbyists (say like China did with the Bill Clinton administration)
Larry, does other government members contributing to the DNC Election fund also count?
Because there were quite a few countries where that happened.
Having the advantage of reading this 2 days later, and the accompanying comments, the article and comments are great. I agree with most of the comments, and indeed have been given additional food for thought. The last comment by Larry Ledwick (always a good source for food for thought) does bring up the question. Does the law have a statute of limitations?
The left hates Trump and calls him stupid. He is far from it. And I think he is laughing at this theater as the left has once again indicted itself! The case that Larry mentions was never fully investigated (Clinton ran the DOJ after all), but the implication is that he is indeed guilty of the crimes the Russia 13 are! And that bit of history would stay buried forever had Mueller not been hired! But Mueller was. And a precedent set. (Algore is implicated in that one up to his eyeballs).
Just like the #meToo meme, this one is coming back to bite the liberals. Indeed, while the public show of Mueller proceeds in the public eye (there are no secrets there apparently due to leaks), the investigations by Sessions continue in the dark. Since that is not being leaked, many feel that Sessions is a dupe. Sessions is not as canny as Trump, but he is no idiot either. The original recusal with Trump’s faux outrage over it is now looking like a master stroke! Sessions works on out of the limelight, and therefore without the left being aware of WHAT is going on.
Each time the left thinks they have Trump, it turns out to merely be a feint in the wrong direction. Firing Mueller? Again, pointing the attention towards Mueller! And away from other investigations ongoing.
The left is impatient for some meat from Mueller. The right for some justice from Sessions. But Trump has his own time line. A drop here, a drop there. Some will come out in the next 6 months. Just enough to solidify the descent of the democrats for the mid terms. But no more. The major revelations will come out in 2 years. Just in time for the 2020 elections.
Trump is no politician (thank god!), and he knows that everything the public sees now is just theater while the real work goes on unseen. He is mad. Why can be speculated on. But he is there to clean up the swamp. And what was created over the past 50 years is not undone over night. He knows it. As a developer, he knows that the project takes years to complete.
The Mueller indictments are a justification for his continuing (and Trump would not mind if they did last another 2 years). The red meat is all Tofu from the left. And it is coming out bit by bit. The YSM will not cover it. But it will come out. And the funny thing about courts of law – the YSM is specifically barred from influencing their workings! Which of course they hate more than Trump himself.
I am investing in popcorn futures.
@beththeserf says: 18 February 2018 at 12:52 am
Thanks for the Soros exposition.
@phil, if only it were just the last 50 years. It is actually nigh on 200 years now. It started in the 1820s after all, gradually building up, akin to a snowball or an avalanche. Whether it’ll be a snowball or an avalanche depends on us.
I used 50 years as that was around the time of the JFK assassination. Which we just learned the tin foil hats had more going for them than thought for the past 50 years.
We will probably never know the full truth about JFK. But given what we know today about the past 2 years, the conspiracy theorists seem to be gaining stature and ground.
Always happens that a AGW denier is also a Trump follower. The statistics shows that’s its never about the science, always about the political agenda.
@Bank Marquee:
AND it always happens that a Science Abuser / Data Rapist is a Hillary follower.
See, both side can play the insult, label, and abuse tactic with emotionally overloaded words. Doesn’t accomplish anything. If YOU have something to say, say what YOU think; and without the use of Propaganda Terms like “AGW Denier”. To look out the window and see the widely propagandized “Hottest Ever!!!” is being met with more snow than usual and a record cold temperature is not to be a “denier” of anything. It is to be a good observer.
Since it was The Left that made AGW a centerpiece of their move to take over government, and through it, remove individual liberties; and do it via fraud, deception, and corruption of science: it is not surprising that The Left constitutes the Radical Global Warming True Believers. Nor is it a surprise that once everyone else figured out the fraud and that it was a political machine driven lie, we would support the alternative.
Now, just because you seem to have missed it: I voted for Bernie Sanders in the California Primary because Hillary was so obviously corrupt. I was an ABC Voter – Anyone But Clinton. So I also voted for Trump when that was my only ABC choice. So does that mean everyone else who voted for Bernie is an “AGW Denier”? Or that your statement is a lie?
See, I do something called “Be The Mirror”. If you are rude and insulting, I become rude and insulting. If you become politically manipulative of language for propaganda effect, I become politically manipulative of language for propaganda effect. As I don’t like being mean, rude, insulting, or politically manipulative of language: Please be polite and non-inflammatory in expressing your opinions. Continue with the “je accuse!” use of “denier” and your tenure here will be short.
Being a “foreigner” is not a crime in the USA. Being a “foreigner” and attempting to influence an election (especially via spending money) IS a crime… unless, of course, you are an illegal alien / Dreamer and want to vote or hold street protests or contribute money to Democrats… /sarc;
https://www.wnyc.org/story/disappointment-democrats-spending-bill-passes/
Erika Andiola, a DACA recipient and former press secretary for Senator Bernie Sanders,
Imagine if Ms Andiola held Russian native nationality …