Tonight’s Tipple & Bang!

Since the National Guard has been called out in several States, including mine, and as the Antifa Terrorists have been happy to bash folks and kick them in the head, I’m now going armed around the house. Not 100%. Sometimes it is just next to me…

Just which is My Little Friend on any one night will change / rotate. I’ve also filled Mr. Shotgun with 7 rounds of bird shot. Yes, it holds 7. A nice Winchester Defender 12 gauge. He’s at one end of the house while I’m often at the other. Just in case I’m “in the wrong end” and anything “dynamic” starts to happen.

Why bother? Because the Antifa Terrorists are active about 4 miles from me and could easily be herded my way or just branch out from the Downtown areas.

Tonight’s Tipple:

Is a nice Australian Shiraz. Yellowtail again. I’ve shopped a half dozen grocery stores and that’s the only Australian brand I’ve found. The usual place for getting decent and unusual imports, BevMo, is not open for browsing (yet).

More fruity than a Cabernet. Richer throat feel and a bit more tannic bite than a Merlot. Would go well with Marinara or Lasagna. I’ll be matching it to some Australian Lamb Chops I picked up. Side of baked potatoes, butter. A bit of garlic and salt on the lamb. That ought to stand up to the Shiraz! I find the strong grape is a bit of a surprise on the first sip, a welcome friend by the third. It would be very hard to back off to a Merlot until some decent time had passed, lest it taste watery and empty…

Tonight’s Bang:

A small house gun or pocket gun. A Beretta 950 in .25 ACP that has a tip-up barrel for loading one in the chamber easily. Single Action, so to “make it go” then you just thumb the hammer back and pull the trigger. I think the magazine holds 8, but I usually only load 6. Yes, the .25 ACP is a wimp. OTOH, all it needs to do is surprise the heck out of someone as it comes from out of nowhere and buy enough time to get to something bigger. Plus, even a .25 ACP is going to give your typical Antifa wimp a brown pants moment.

The ammunition du jour is an old Western Super X from about 30 years ago (last time the gun was fired) or maybe 40 years ago (about when I bought it). 50 gr. Full Metal Case hollow points. Ballistics tests make it more than a low end .22 LR and less than a .32 ACP (which was the Nazi officers gun of W.W.II and used by many European police forces until recently). Noise level is modest (a feature for me if I’ve not had time to put ear plugs in yet) and something like a .357 Magnum inside would leave me permanently deaf, so not really an option.

The wiki gives these specs:

Specifications
Mass	280g/9.9oz
Length	120 mm (4.7 in)
Width	23 mm (0.9 in)
Height	87 mm (3.4 in)

And reports last date of manufacture was 2003. Guess it’s a “classic” pocket pistol now ;-)

I first saw these in the gun case at the Old Home Town hardware store when I was about 8. I’d go and lust after them every few days. Everyone knew everyone in that small farm town and so having “Ed’s Kid” hanging around was no big deal. Did get to listen to a lot of chatter at the counter over the years. Finally scratched that itch almost 20 years later.

The .25 ACP has about 65 ft-lbs (88 J) of energy (about the same as a .22 LR in similar guns) but with less noise and more efficient burn (shorter fuel stack height and greater diameter).

All in a package that disappears in a pocket. Easy thing to just have there all day long. Not something you can do with a 9mm Beretta…

As the Riot Days drag on, I’ll do various “change ups” on the carry / house gun. I’ve got 3 or 4 that I like. The .22 LR variation on this design has gone on to the Son for his collection. A nice nickle finish to it too. But I still have a few others ;-)

Oh, and should anyone wish to make Tsk Tsk noises about how under powered a .25 ACP round is: Do remember that comment about 7 rounds of 12 gauge if there’s a chance to get it. This is ONLY for having “not very visible” in a pocket All Day Long… Also consider what a 1/4 inch hole does to attitude when placed well, and I can generally place it well at the max 10 feet range likely in my home for such encounters.

And with that, it looks like my wine glass has run dry. Time to check on the lamb and refill the glass ;-)

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About E.M.Smith

A technical managerial sort interested in things from Stonehenge to computer science. My present "hot buttons' are the mythology of Climate Change and ancient metrology; but things change...
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60 Responses to Tonight’s Tipple & Bang!

  1. Nancy & John Hultquist says:

    Democrats are the best gun salesforce ever.
    They are terrible at most everything else.

  2. E.M.Smith says:

    I’m embarrassed to admit that about 1/2 the guns I own were bought in response to some idiot Democrat Ban effort or another…

    I’ve also got enough ammo to defend the Alamo, again thanks to California having an Ammo Sales Registration system that I saw coming. I need never buy any more ammunition the rest of my life. THEN I’ll need to start seriously reloading with all the reloading supplies / equipment I bought 20 years ago ;-)

    Oh Well. It is what it is.

    Frankly, I gave about 1/2 my collection to my Son when he reached “a certain age” and was getting the Gun Hots. Figured I’d save him a few $Thousands ;-) and records. I was in Florida at the time, as a resident of there, so under Florida laws. I’m still left with too many guns ;-)

    But a far smaller range of calibers to support / feed. Narrowing in on .22, .32 ACP, 9mm / .357 and 12 gauge. There’s a few other odd bits and bobs (like a .25 ACP and a .40 S&W) but not too many left. I probably need to give him another 1/4 next time I’m a Florida resident. (California requires a bucket of paperwork even for a family member).

    Oh Well. I’ll be happy to be judged by 12 should that moment ever arise. A “Sixty-something” in is own home facing a mob with history of violence… Yeah, I’ll take that.

    In other notes:

    The lamb was delicious. Really. These are the inch+ thick mini-T-Bone shaped ones. In a cast iron skillet in the oven. Drizzle of olive oil and sprinkle of garlic salt. Oh My God good! About 375 F and somewhere just over 1/2 hour (or to your liking of bloody bits and red at about 20 minutes…)

    The baker was fluffy to a fault. 2 of them in the microwave for 3 minutes a side (i.e. 2 times with a rollover) then into the oven with the lamb.

    Finished with Black Current Jam in the bottom of a small bowl, yogurt on top, then blueberries sprinkled on top. Mix bites as you go ;-)

  3. ossqss says:

    I have talked with many law enforcement , and other officers, about caliber preference at various classes. They all said the same thing. I doesn’t matter the weapon, it matters how good you use it for purpose, and you have to practice to use anything right.

  4. E.M.Smith says:

    @Ossqss:

    That’s generally true. “Shot placement” matter more than Miracle Caliber. A 12 gauge into the shins is not going to kill you. A .22 short into the heart or brain can.

    There’s a variety of “extenuating circumstances” on that point, though. My Sgt. Sensei had a story for us students about a street encounter with a Big Thug on PCP. They shot him with a whole bunch of 9mm and .40 S&W and he as just not slowing down. We’re talking like a dozen hits kind of thing. Finally he went back to the squad car and got the 12 gauge slug. Right square in the plexus it shattered his spine. THEN he went down (to die a little later…).

    At the other end of things, most any round can cut the carotid or take out the heart control systems stopping it. Then it’s just a bit of time. Reagan was hit with a .22 and was hospitalized for a good long while. Brady was basically brain-gone after that.

    Part of why I don’t really get all excited about the Caliber Wars. “Any gun is better than no gun” and I’d add that “some skill beats a bigger bullet”. Thus my being more than satisfied with a .25 ACP in the pocket. It is completely hidden by my hand, should I wish it. The potential for misdirection and illusion makes that more lethal than a .40 S&W in that drawer over there…

    Side Note on Shiraz:

    After a 1/2 liter, it tastes a lot more like Cabernet ;-)

  5. ossqss says:

    I hear ya EM. Like I said, for purpose. It all depends on what that purpose is. If you want to stop someone in their tracks, you don’t have to put one in a lethal spot. Just one that stops them from moving forward further. As learned via martial arts, the knee is required to do much of anything offensive.

    With respect to your reference above on thugs on drugs, that is why I mostly carry a G30S.

    Crazy times folks. Crazy.

  6. ossqss says:

    Couldn’t stop my mouse :-)

  7. E.M.Smith says:

    OMG! The G30S is sweet! A compact .45 ACP. Now I want one… yeah, only 10 rds. But Cali. limits you to that anyway.

  8. Ian W says:

    E.M. The other good thing about lamb is that it is one of the richest sources of dietary zinc so will improve innate immunity to viral infections such as SARS-CoV-2 – as well as tasting excellent. California sun for vitamin D and a brazil nut a day for the selenium and that’s your innate immune system all set :-)

  9. Bill In Oz says:

    The biggest online website that sells Australian wine is Dan Murphy’s. Their range is vast and their prices very, very good. I’m not sure if they supply via online to the USA. But you could ask.
    https://help.danmurphys.com.au/hc/en-us/articles/360000042195-Placing-an-Online-Order

  10. A C Osborn says:

    E M, what is the recoil like on the 0.25 being a small gun?

  11. corsair red says:

    I was visitng my mother in the nearby town where several relatives live. Had been thinking about getting a pistol, so I stopped into a pawn shop / gun dealer there. When I told the owner I was pistol shopping, he asked what I had in mind. When I said a 9, he said, ” Why? You need to consider stopping power for a self-defense gun. ” He then praised the 45 as the only caliber a sensible person would want , and showed me 2 or 3. I thanked him and left.

    Today I own a couple of . . . hmm, not 45s, along with various other examples of defense items. ;)

  12. H.R. says:

    E.M., you reminded me that hardware stores used to be the gun stores for most of America and definitely for small town America where there wasn’t enough population to support a stand-alone gun store. You also could buy mail order through the Sears catalog or straight from some of the manufacturers.

    There are still some hardware stores in small towns that have a gun case with a few handguns and some rifles and shotguns in a rack. They mostly sell ammo to farmers and hunters.

    Sure, the laws have changed on mail order purchases, but one of the big crimps in shops with a small gun counter is the reporting requirements. Very few small shops, where the guns are just a small part of sales, can afford to have someone on their limited staff tied up for 20 or 30 minutes on a sale spent mostly complying with records keeping and a background check. If they mark up enough to cover the time spent, then they are too high and customers go to cheaper sources for the same firearm.

    The gun grabbers have not been successful so far with outright bans. The 2nd Amendment is still being supported in the courts. But the disarm-the-populace gang has been very successful in stifling guns sales by burying sellers in paperwork.

  13. Paul, Somerset says:

    Here in England you can’t prepare lamb without a sprinkle of rosemary. Them’s the rules. (Just a sprinkling – a little rosemary goes a long way; that’s why I also like rosemary with venison, as it easily moderates the more “gamey” flavours.)

  14. E.M.Smith says:

    @Bill In Oz:

    I’ll check it out!

    @A.C.Osborn:

    The recoil is near nothing in any gun.

    @Corsair Red:

    I very much love the .45 ACP. Part of the acceptance test by the Army in 1911 was that it had to stop a horse…

    As a low pressure cartridge it is easier on the ears and less blinding flash. Even in military ball ammo it is quite enough gun. Thin brass is easy to reload.

    The only bad bits are the fat round means fewer in the magazine and low velocity means a lot of bullet drop.

    A 9mm is the standard for essentially all armies as it is just about an ideal balance of power and small diameter / weight to carry. There is a .380 ACP hollow point (Winchester Silvertip) that has the same one shot stop statistics as the military ball .45 ACP, and that’s about the lower bound for reliable one shot stops. But illustrates the importance of bullet choice. With multiple shots, even a .22 rimfire or .25 ACP is enough. If you want more than a 9mm, the .40 S&W is great. My favorite is my Sig in .357 Sig AND .40 S&W via a barrel change. By .44 Magnum, you are in the land of flinching and blinding flash with deafening noise indoors. Great for bear and hogs though… when in doubt, just use a 12 gauge or 20 gauge magnum pump shotgun.

    My biased oppinions.

    I chose based on the needed atributes. Big for big problems that don’t need concealed, dinky for easy to pocket and low probability of a big need. My smallest is the Beretta in .22 SHORT. My biggest is now a couple of .357 magnum or .357 Sig and the .40 S&W. Son now has the .45 ACP stuff. My Zombie Apocalypse gun is an SKS Carbine and a crate of ammo along with a dozen stripper clips. With bayonet.

    I don’t worry about much….

  15. E.M.Smith says:

    @Paul:

    But I love the gamey flavor!
    ;-)

  16. ossqss says:

    I find compatible magazines are a big bonus. The G19 30 round clips fit the Sub2000 and such. I believe KelTec is actually building a .45 ACP Sub2000 per their solicited polling late last year on .40 or .45. Heck you can get 30 round clips for the G21 that are compatible with the 30s and 30 I think. Either way, the 9mm is a much lighter and cheaper ammo in the end overall. The 45 would not be in my bugout bag, just due to weight and size of ammo. That is where the 10/22 takedown will be.

    Home protection is still the Judge and Tactical Circuit Judge rifle with the PDX1 “all in one” ammo alternating if necessary with a Long Colt round. That above my 12 gauge even though it could hold a few more rounds than the Judge revolvers.

    I would say, having the built in rails to attach a light/laser is beneficial also, no matter the weapon in SHTF times. Don’t over look that option if your looking.

  17. Sera says:

    .38 Super using 124 gr. hollow base round nose, just over 1350 fps gives well over 500 ft-lbs and a power factor of 167 (enough for major). It holds more rounds than a .45 and has better manners.

    Best purchase ever.

  18. E.M.Smith says:

    @Sera:

    Why I like the 357 Sig.. Essentially the same as that Super load in the lighter loadings, but just via a bbl swap! (Hotter loadings go up to 1900 fps and 700+ ft-lbs) so bassically 357 Magnum range.

    My Cz 75 convinced me the race guns built on that pattern were the way to go, and the guys shooting 38 Super in such race guns were putting up impressive scores, showing those good manners you mentioned. But I didn’t have the $ killobuck or 2 needed to get one.

    Very popular in Latin America (where some national laws forbid civilians owning military caliber guns), in the USA the hot 9mm +p+ pushed it out of wide use.

    I’d still love to get one. But I still don’t have the spare $$. Oh well.

    @Tim:

    It is likely too late to get one. But yeah, better late than never.

    Watching video of the folks attacked: your only hope is superior firepower.

    These are mob attack packs. No one person can fight them off (even the guy with a sword) and you will go down. Then, instead of being in a grapple with your opponent where you might win, instead it is kicks and stomps from many directions directed at your head until you are unconscious or dead. Clearly a learned / trained and shared tactic. You would need at least 10 (and preferably much more) round capacity, rapid fire, already on you. (I’ve topped up my little Beretta to its full 9 round capacity) AND willingness to use it immediately on threat. There is no time to negotiate or decide before the mob has encircled.

    I’ll not be politely stopping my car (they have shown that results in being hauled from your truck and stomped). Keep moving or die means I keep moving, even through them. I’ll not be unarmed anywhere I can legally be armed. Do not expect any Geneva rules or legal niceties to be afforded to you. This is primative brutal tribal warfare and you can not reason with it. Watch the videos and study them. It is open mob warfare with no bounds nor rules of civility.

    Any single person or even a couple is seen as a soft target. Be in bigger groups if possible.

    IMHO, the most likely to work tactic is to shoot and scoot. Tap a couple, reposition away, repeat. Do not allow time for mob encirclement. The guy who killed one had already fired “warning shots”. He got jumped on from behind and blindly fired over his shoulder killing the attacker riding his back. So these folks are not afraid of guns (gang bangers? Hopped up? Who knows). Warning shots are wasted shots. You need to be in motion to protect your back and opening an escape hole in the encirclement.

    Given the waiting period, the right time to get a gun was months ago. A novice gun owner is unlikely to have the needed skill OR attitude to do the necessary tactics.

  19. Tim. says:

    Good job I’m in the UK. Who is paying these louts? Do they just do it for pleasure?

  20. E.M.Smith says:

    @Tim:

    Both: Soros via his NGOs (straight out of his Color Revolution playbook), then leveraging that money via grants and other donors, along with Democrat fellow travelers. (Some name names were in the news paying their bail… and De Blasio’s daughter was busted in the streets with the mob… and he’s OK with that…) PLUS the folks doing it love the adrenaline, blood sport, and booty.

    FWIW: Watching De Blasio live right now. Just OMG the incompetence and he seems to be emotionally losing it. Denial is strong in him and a lot of his statements are just stoopid. We’ve seen that that police are completely overwhelmed and he’s insisting they don’t need help and National Guard would not work (when they have often quelled riots). He’s angry at questions. So there’s your problem. “Argue for your limitations and you shall keep them. -E.M.Smith” He’s arguing for his demonstrably broken limited response “venting” strategy and will keep his city broken and looted. He ask the citizens to fix it via saying no. Well saying no to a mob gets your head kicked in.

  21. agimarc says:

    The run on 9 mm ammo that was on during the shutdown in AK continues. Was briefly better after restocked sporting goods stores reopened. Took a couple weeks to bingo bullets again. Expected to continue for a while (end of summer if we’re lucky).

    On a completely unrelated topic: Costco is still out of their nitrile exam gloves. Have been out for 4 – 6 weeks. Cheers –

  22. E.M.Smith says:

    @Agimarc:

    Smart & Final here has loads of nitril gloves, but no latex. Shop around…

    Years back I set up for 9mm / .357 reloading. I can do about 1k rounds before I have to inventory supplies (primers are my only real limit as I can cast bullets if needed).

    Part of why I bought several guns in various calibers was for the ability to shoot “whatever” is not in shortage. While some of these have gone on to the son, I’m still well enough diversified.

    On of my favorites is my Ruger revolver in 9mm / .357 Magnum. It also will shoot (and has shot ) 38 Specials and the shorter 38 Smith & Wesson (along with some other obsolete 38s). I can literally say “what have you got in 9mm or 38/ 357? ” [or .40 S&W or .357 Sig, or 7.62 x 25 Tokarev (barrel change in Chinese Browning 9mm knockoff) or .32 ACP, or .25 ACP , or .22 (any rimfire), or… based on a different gun choice] I now longer have any .45 ACP or .223 Remington, but I think that’s OK… maybe ;-)

    Then there’s always the shotguns… Son got the 20 Gauge, but I kept the pre-steel shot double bbl and the Defender (18 inch cylinder or 24″ rifled slug bbl with magazine length adapter / long end cap) in 12 gauge. Yeah, 8 round of slugs in 24 inch bbl with good sights… I liked the 20 gauge better, but that 20 ga. Defender version doesn’t have the long magazine.

    FWIW I’ve been ramping down the inventory, figuring I can make sure they go where they will be cared for (and out of California’s reach). Slowly narrowing in on the .357 / 9mm cluster and 12 gauge where I’m set up for reloading, plus the dinky calibers that are very fun and pocketable. Basically, .32 & .25 ACP plus .22 rimfire.

    FWIW, after reviewing the video from the latest round of riots, the Beretts Tomcat in .32 ACP with 8 rounds of Silvertips is now in the ankle holster. So that makes 17 rounds w/ the .25 ACP gun. Yes, all relatively low power, but were talking indoors likely no hearing protection and my damaged ears… so I’m incredibly reluctant to fire as that means deafness again and mitigating that matters a lot. IF I have time, plugs are on my keyring… (I usually shoot with plugs and muffs for 9mm or magnums but still notice a bit of increased ringing after an extended shoot)

    Plus the one shot stop statistic for Silvertip is close to military ball .45 ACP and I’ve got more than one shot ;-)

    The muffs and 9mm are together at the other end of the house from my office. IFF I am there or have time to get there, It is muffs on and grab the 9. If not, it is hopefully “enough gun and not too much hearing loss”

    Though I’m pretty sure nothing is going sideways in Santa Clara. At least for now. So hopefully this is all just practice drill. The problems seem to mostly be “back east” plus L.A. to Las Vegas. If things start to decay more, I’ll buy a second pair of muffs for this end of the house ;-‘)

  23. jim2 says:

    Springfield Armory 9mm XDM features a 19 round mag. Nice for “social” situations.

  24. llanfar says:

    I finally settled on my first gun a couple months back – Sig P320 X5 Legion. It’s big and heavy, with less recoil than the other guns I tried. And fits my hand perfectly.

  25. E.M.Smith says:

    @Jim2:

    Unfortunately, here in The Peoples Republik Of Kalifornia, we have a 10 round limit on magazines (no grandfathering either I think. Thus my Cz brace going to the Son early.) They’ve done a few variations on that law over the years and I just got tired of trying to keep track. Thus my 10 rd Sig in .40 S&W instead of 9mm. (And a second gun instead of a bigger magazine… Hey, saves a magazine change ;-)

    Somehow The State can’t quite understand that limiting one gun to 10 rds just sells a second gun and a two holster rig…

    @Illanfar:

    A great choice!

    In my experience, hand fit and shooting comfort matters more than anything else for satisfaction. Well, maybe AFTER it is shown to reliably go bang!

    The Cz fit my hand perfectly. The brace of 75 (right hand) and 85 (ambidextrous / left) with 16 in each IIRC so 32 rounds; that was my goto kit for many years. But not acceptable to Kalifornia, so my right to “keep” was infringed. Oh Well. (So instead it will be 4 stripper clips of 10 each 7.62x 39 in a politically correct SKS with bayonet. No, don’t even try to figure out why that’s OK and a pistol is not… or my shotgun with effectively unlimited capacity as you can stuff more in between shots.)

    The little Beretta is sweet to hold for me, as is my Walther PP. But the Beretta Tomcat is much lighter in holster or pocket. I liked my .45 1911, but it felt just a bit or a stretch for my short fat fingers. Just never could like it as much as the Cz for that hand feel reason.

    So that, IMHO, is why there are so many different guns and grips, and why there is no “best gun” without saying for whom and for what use.

  26. philjourdan says:

    @Bill in Oz – re: sales to the US. It depends upon the state. I am sure Chiefio’s state will allow it ,but alas my state is still stuck in prohibition. The state sells all spirits. And frowns upon mail order. And it is a solid blue jerk state.

  27. Serioso says:

    Some of the “Antifa Terrorists:, as you like to call them, turn out to be white nationalists running a false flag operation:

    https://news.yahoo.com/antifa-twitter-account-called-looting-141834707.html

  28. E.M.Smith says:

    @Serioso:

    I’m sure there’s plenty of evil to go around to all sides. The reality, though, is that very many of the Antifa group are violent thugs more than happy to do violence all on their own. Look at the hours of video of them destroying various cities. LOTS of Black on White violence in those videos too.

    So you manged to find an example of a False Flag TWEET. Good for you. (Though I would like to know how they proved it was, as they assert. Didn’t see much evidence, just assertion. Not really doubting that it very well could be real, though. Lots of idiots in the world on both “sides”) Now compare a TWEET with a destroyed NYC downtown. I’m pretty sure a TWEET didn’t deliver pallets of bricks, bottles of accelerant, and a few hundreds to thousands of rioters to cities all over the nation In Sync and organized.

    So nice Cherry Pick, but irrelevant to what Antifa and their Black Bloc are.

  29. E.M.Smith says:

    @Phil & Bill In Oz:

    I found a Wines Of The World that’s open and it looks like they may allow browsing the isles. I’m going to check them out in the next couple of days. It’s a huge store so will likely have a great selection of Australian Wines. ;-)

    Am I going to drink Australia dry? Nope. But a fella can try! ;-)

  30. E.M.Smith says:

    @Sera:

    You got me interested in the .38 Super and did some digging to see if they can be fired in a .357 Magnum too (being semi-rimmed).

    You find a lot of pages saying a theoretical “no” and tsk-tisking about “risk”, and you find several folks saying “done it”.

    The bottom line is about 0.005 inch greater diameter of the Super so some very tight cylinders may not accept fat cartridges, and 2 brands (Winchester and CCI IIRC) were more likely to work than the others. Super pressure is a bit higher than 357 Mag spec, but well under 357 Mag Proofing loads, so the pressure argument is basically irrelevant.

    I’m not going to go out and buy any just to re-do what others have done, but should the event ever arise where I’m desperate for something, anything, to shoot in EOTWAWKI, I’d be willing to try some as a last ditch thing. I could likely also just run them up the 357 die in my reloader and swage them down a bit if really needed. But doing that with already loaded cases would be a bit daft / explosive potential, and if I’m doing reloading I can just use my pile of proper brass…

    But it is an interesting idea…

  31. Sera says:

    Hmmm. I can use the .356 bullet for reloading .357, but never thought about the casing. The cases I use are semi-rimmed, but some (.38 super comp) are not. I’ll stick one in the .357 five inch tomorrow and let you know how it fits.

    I HAVE shot .38 special in my .357, so there’s that…

  32. ossqss says:

    Always stay within the spec of your weapon. No moonclips, P+ ammo etc.. unless it can handle it or things may go sideways. JMHO from experience.

  33. E.M.Smith says:

    @Ossqss:

    Generally, yes, proper advice. Do note that the pressure of .38 Super is about 1,500 over the .357 pressure while the .357 proofing load is about 10,000 units over at somewhere around 45,000. So every .357 Magnum has already fired a stronger load, by a lot.

    I’d not try it in some cheap POS (Piece Of S…) gun, but my revolvers are Rugers and generally considered the stongest for making overpressure wildcats.

    As risks go, this one is pretty lame.

    Where I’d be worried is the semi-rim and how it would hold up. Then again, the semi-rim cartridges were invented at the start of the revolver to auto shift as a way to make cartridges more auto friendly but still usable in the revolvers of the era.

    Like I said: I’d not do it on a regular basis, but in an EOTWAWKI Zombie Apocalypse where the alternative is zombification, I’d go for it.

  34. E.M.Smith says:

    Interesting… the 38 Super +P is not actually a heavier loaded 38 Super but just a plain old 38 Super:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.38_Super

    The .38 Super retains the original dimensions of the .38 ACP case. The cartridge was originally designed to headspace on the semi-rim, which worked in the Colt M1900 due to the design of the feed ramp. When the .38 Auto became the .38 Super, in the 1911A1, the feed ramp could no longer be used as rim support. As a result of this, observed accuracy of the .38 Super suffered until Irv Stone of Bar-Sto barrels re-designed the chamber to allow headspacing on the case mouth. Since then, all new production .38 Super pistols headspace on the case mouth, as with other cartridges in this class. The semi-rimmed case is known to cause feeding problems in some magazines, especially double stack magazines, and led to the development of new variants with reduced rims (typically only .003 inch per side).

    In 1974, the industry added the +P headstamp to the .38 Super to further distinguish it from the lower-pressure .38 ACP. Most current ammunition manufacturers label ammunition for the Super as .38 Super +P.

    So it is OK to headspace on the rim, and the 38 Super +P isn’t increased pressure. But this also says the 38 ACP (.38 Auto as opposed to 380 Auto that’s a 9mm kurtz/corto) is the same size but lower pressure. Nice to know. At 26,500 PSI, more than 38 Special but way under 357 Magnum at 35,000 PSI
    http://www.lasc.us/SAAMIMaxPressure.htm

  35. E.M.Smith says:

    Found a nice video that demonstrates the Tomcat .32 ACP and mentions the 950 in .25 ACP.

    He also does a good job explaining why I like them ;-)

  36. philjourdan says:

    @Sorioso – and that turned out to be a red herring that even the SPLC could not back up.

    I love it when you own yourself Which is most of the time, The few white nationalists there are, are too busy protecting their homes from antifa – the fascist organization. That is also the racist organization. – https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/bryan-preston/2020/06/04/video-white-masked-antifa-attack-black-police-officer-call-him-n-word-n494065

    Was that you? It does bear some similarities.

  37. Serioso says:

    After you have learned to read and write intelligently, and to spell, I might answer you. In the meantime you wight go to antifa.com You might learn something. Antifa is not an actual organization. It’s a figment of Trump’s paranoid imagination — and yours.

  38. ossqss says:

    wight (spelling) you want to explain your point >

    You don’t think there is an organized response happening?
    You don’t think that cities are burning?
    You think that local people protesting are intentionally destroying their local ability to conduct commerce “Locally”?

    C’mon, show us how destroying local communities and businesses is some how good for America.

  39. Sera says:

    @ ossqss:

    Why did you have to mention moon clips? I had never heard of them before- you bastard! Now I have to find a machine shop and…. I’ll deal with you later ; )

    @ Chiefio:

    Yes. They do fit nicely. S&W mod 686* and walked over to the red box (hot loads, new brass) and pulled one out. It dove into the chamber no problem. I pushed the ejector and it came out but did not feel ‘right’. So I loaded all six chambers (again, all just dove in, no problem), but they did not eject properly. A little fussy at best. Grabbed the blue box (light loads- reloads) and tried them. You know how the cases bulge a little, after shooting, and still after resizing? Well, those went in but stopped 1/8″ before seating. I could easily push them all the way in, but there’s that. And it was a pain to eject them.

    ALL .38 Super loads are for five inch barrels, unless special ordered, so I see no compression problems using them in my .357 with a 4″ barrel. I would not try them in barrels above 5″.

    .38 short Colt, .38 long Colt, .38 Special can be used safely in a .357 magnum.

    Moon clips. OMG.

  40. Sera says:

    Comment caught in spam?

    Test

  41. E.M.Smith says:

    @Phil:

    Please avoid “insults to the person” and keep things polite.

    @Serioso:

    The notion that Antifa doesn’t exist is absurd on the face of it.

    They have: a web site, a handbook, a uniform (black bloc), gatherings, communications, a flag, organization, training episodes, etc. etc.

    Yes, their leadership emphasizes that there ought to be no IDENTIFIABLE leadership, just to make law enforcement difficult, but they do still exist. The FBI will have no trouble following the $100 million donated to them recently by the Soros organizations.

    They are just your garden variety terrorist cell structure at the lower levels. Classical communists.

  42. Serioso says:

    Y’all might see better if you stopped covering your eyes! Have you heard about the boogaloo movement?

    https://news.yahoo.com/boogaloo-arrests-in-nevada-portray-extremists-using-protests-to-incite-civil-war-131125733.html

  43. p.g.sharrow says:

    And Seriosi yells ” LOOK LOOK A SQUIRREL !!
    no antifa here.

    right, those aren’t uniformed troops walking through the streets smashing windows and heads, throwing bricks and Molotov Cocktails

    Can’t be that stupid, must be a plant.

  44. E.M.Smith says:

    Again verging on / moving toward insult via implied incompetence. Be careful of that. You know you have sensitized the tendency to insult. Yes, you stayed on the snark side, but snark does not become you.

    Per “boogaloo”:

    It is just a term some folks use as shorthand for a “civil war” they think might happen. I learned from a middle left guy and his vegan sidekick.

    There is no “movement”.

    Certainly not one that is a “collection of extremists, including far-right militias, radical gun rights activists, white supremacists and neo-Nazis.”

    First off, the militia is defined in the constitution and it is all us guys, like it or not, right, left, and middle.

    Gun rights folks come from all political groups. My old college roomy being very left and pro gun rights.

    I’ve not seen any “white supremacists” since the ’70s. At this point they are at most a few whackos in the back woods trotted out by “journalists” looking to scare small children.

    Neonazis? You mean like Antifa and the radical National Socialists?

    What you have in that article is a leftist fantasy hodgepodge of stereotypes bundled up in a clickbait wrapper that might well be its own false flag. It reads like a propaganda cover.

    I have no doubt two guys got arrested saying boogaloo. Everything beyond that is fiction.

  45. Sera says:

    One other thing. Starline brass sells .38 Super AND .38 Super+P. The difference is heavy duty material for the +P, probably for comp shooting.

    https://www.starlinebrass.com/38-super-plusp-brass

  46. Serioso says:

    How about another article on the boogaloo movement:

    https://news.yahoo.com/young-white-men-long-guns-180208628.html

  47. p.g.sharrow says:

    Another Serioso pointing to a made up “fact” that is without any proof, Just a bunch of supposition and speculations. In other words ……..lies for weak brains

  48. E.M.Smith says:

    Oh Gawd,

    Having been suckered into looking into “boogaloo”: Looks like it started as a meme on 4chan about a year ago, so most likely another of the 4chan & 8chan guys chain yanking pranks (like claiming the OK hand sign was racist and watching left wing folks go nuts about it)

    Clear sign it’s a prank on the gullible left? The spelling of bois in “boogaloo bois” is a minor clue (no conservative person applies that to themselves) but the biggy is the “uniform” is cammo AND HAWIIAN SHIRTS!

    Just OMG what a hoot. It will be great full watching The Left go nuts about Hawaiian shirts. I need to find somewhere that ships them. I can use my DISNEY STORE cammo hat with it and measure the “triggerings per hour” to see how widespread the suckers are!

  49. E.M.Smith says:

    Oh Boy!

    I can get a Disney Hawaiian shirt collection from Amazon, then paired with my Indiana Jones hat (bought last time I was on the ride), have an all Disney boogaloo “uniform”!

    https://www.amazon.com/disney-hawaiian-shirt/s?k=disney+hawaiian+shirt

    Need to find some matching Disney pants though….

  50. E.M.Smith says:

    On a site that was all wrapped up in virtue signaling, an interesting comment:

    Big Igloo Watcher – June 5, 2020
    Boogaloo is a 4chan/Reddit meme and Boogaloo memesters show up at events and conflagrations in Hawaian shirts and replica tactical gear for photo ops, nothing more.
    Most of the guns “toted” by these colorful characters are jus realistic looking airsoft toys.
    The fact that hysterical ninnies are taking them seriously is absolutely hilarious and puts the wind in their sails for further shenanigans.

    So at least one other has got the joke ;-)

  51. Serioso says:

    More information on fake antifa accounts and similar false flag operations;

    “Facebook has removed nearly 200 social media accounts linked to white supremacy groups that planned to encourage members to attend protests over police killings of black people — in some cases with weapons, company officials said Friday.

    The accounts on Facebook and Instagram were tied to the Proud Boys and the American Guard, two hate groups already banned on the platforms. Officials were already monitoring the accounts in preparation for removing them when they saw posts attempting to exploit the ongoing protests prompted by the death of George Floyd in Minneapolis.

    “We saw that these groups were planning to rally supporters and members to physically go to the protests and in some cases were preparing to go with weapons,” said Brian Fishman, Facebook’s director of counterterrorism and dangerous organizations policy.

    The company did not divulge details of the account users — such as their specific plans for protests or where in the U.S. they live. It said “approximately” 190 accounts were removed overall.

    Both the Proud Boys and American Guard had been banned from Facebook for violating rules prohibiting hate speech. Facebook said it will continue to remove new pages, groups or accounts created by users trying to circumvent the ban.

    Earlier this week, Facebook announced the removal of a “handful” of other accounts created by white supremacists who had been posing on Twitter as members of the far-left antifa movement.
    …..
    …..
    The network of fake accounts and pages was uncovered by the Atlantic Council’s Digital Forensic Research Lab. In their report, researchers at the DFRL said they’ve noticed more and more PR firms dabbling in misinformation and online manipulation.”

    https://news.yahoo.com/facebook-removes-nearly-200-accounts-210050355.html

  52. E.M.Smith says:

    Serioso:

    Do remember that, due to severe overuse, the Dog Whistle terms “racist” and “white supremacist” have lost all denotative meaning. Now being reduced to “I hate you” as approved Left Wing Hate Speech. (This happened when several blacks were being accused of being “racist” by Antifa drones and related).

    Similarly, due to the Silly Con Valley Free Speech Suppression efforts, “hate speech” now just means “something the hard left hates”.

    So unfortunately, listing a bunch of “bla bla” stuff banned by Twitter Twits or Failsbook doesn’t mean anything other than The Left hates them and wants to attack them. Like Candace Owens, a beautiful Black Woman labled “racist” in public for not swallowing the Left Pary Line and daring to leave the plantation. Welcomed fully by The Right and Republicans.

    I know it’s hard on the Democrats, losing their GoTo race baiting tactic and all. And they ARE trying mightily to stir up race hatred; but it just isn’t working. Black POTUS. Black SCOTUS judges. Black megarich movie stars, sports stars, and Generals. Black mayors running the black police chiefs with black officers. It just doesn’t fit the narrative.

    So you (they) are reduced to finding the 1 in a million cases and trying desperately to hype them up. And we see that. Clearly.

    But do bang on about it. It’s amusing to watch.

  53. jim2 says:

    Seriously? So someone wants to have a handbag fight over obscure and unprovable articles and “studies” to show their side isn’t the anarchists shooting/running over police, throwing rocks and burning other peoples property.

    It’s really easy to figure out the side most probable to do things like that. Let’s tip our hat to Bayes and take a more top-down and use way more obvious data.

    Leftist politicians have seriously put forth suggestions that we get rid of the Electoral College, get rid of the Senate, confiscate private property, confiscate money from one group and give it to another, ban guns, and continually want to put in place more and more socialist programs. OTOH, the right generally defends these institutions, laws, and rights.

    Based on that, what side is most probably rioting in the streets to tear down the great country we and our ancestors have built?????

    THE LEFT!

  54. E.M.Smith says:

    Just to polish a point:

    See, that’s how the censorship kills its own story.

    Had those folks postings and pages been left up for all to see, we could know if they were truly vile, or not. But instead they were removed. Now all we have is the word of neurotic snowflake hard left radicals. But they have demonstrated they are at best horrible judges with an agenda; at worst lying partisan hacks.

    They have repeatedly banned perfectly benign stuff for political reasons (why can’t I say the proper name of Charley Mello, for example…) like Preger U. They brand anyone who does not 100% toe the Party Line with the mantra “Racist, bigot, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic, ” bla bla bla even to include blacks and gay men (who have now been welcomed by the Republicans).

    Cancel Culture Warriors set out to destroy people and lives for not loving Hillary and the DNC. (See Alex Jones as most visible, but hundreds of others after him) Any conservative gets a riot for being invited to speak on a college campus (even if a Jew, curiously called “nazi” in the insult stream). A female (I’d say Lady, but she clearly isn’t) Lawyer (on her way to ex-lawyer) was tossing molotov cocktails at police cars in the latest Antifa Riots. A Berkeley Prof. was clocking coservatives over the head with a bike lock and chain in the batch a couple of years back. We’ve watched all this live on TV.

    So now you want me to just “trust them” to label the people they hate correctly?

    Sorry, but any hope of trust left when they started burning the bridges of truth behind them.

    Credibility, once dead, does not revive.

    So show me some “story” from the left, my first thought now is to find the lies in it, or just ignore it. I’ve learned this behaviour over several years of Russiagate, Obamagate, Maddow Nightly Lie-fest, Hillary emails, FISA Abuse, CNN fraudulent stories, etc. Etc. You’ve been here to see it. (I used to believe the “news” first, then only check odd bits, about 6 years ago… that has now changed due to the blatant political fraud of the press. Like Donna passing Hillary the questions).

    So basically, if I can’t examine the source docs, it starts out with the presumption it is a Left Lie. Most often, that now proves true. TDS is a terrible thing and the sufferers of the left have done this to themselves.

  55. philjourdan says:

    @sorrioso – I learned how to read and write before you were born. That is how I know Antifa is a fascist organization. That is how I know that the only difference between Hitler and Stalin was the scope of their socialism, not the fact they were both socialist. That is how I know that Antifa has been outed by Project Veritas (just recently) and Andy Ngo. And so many others with videos of their fascist tactics that only a fool or an idiot would try to defend them (yea, I know, all faked – like your news).

    Sorry, your pathetic attempt at diversion just will not work with knowledgeable folks! But I guess you just use it on the dupes. That is the only reason you still try it.

    What a pathetic excuse for a rebuttal.

  56. philjourdan says:

    Please avoid “insults to the person” and keep things polite.

    I asked if that was him. But I can see where the implication is that it was him. For that I withdraw my implication.

    The rest is just a recitation of facts.

  57. philjourdan says:

    @Sorrioso – Re: another article. From the same source? Give us a break! Even McCabe used a different source (albeit from the original same source) to promote the Hillary/Russian disinformation campaign!

    What? You are running out of money and can no longer afford to outsource to another source to bounce back to your original discredited source?

    I guess that is progress.

  58. philjourdan says:

    @Sorrioso

    It is not “more information”, it is the same fake news information! How many times do you have to be sucked in by the lies to stop believing them? For the past 4 years, you have been regurgitating acknowledged lies. And you continue to do so. You have YET to publish one provable fact, and have published so many provable lies that I have lost count!

    And you still bleat “trust me”. You are the worst excuse for a source for anything truthful. Just another sheep bleating what Napoleon told you to.

    When you get some facts, tell us! Until then, stop repeating lies and bleating like a fricking sheep!

  59. ossqss says:

    So, never got a response from some basic questions for our Boogie Woogie guy talking down to everyone from a college professor position …. C’mon man, did you take a salary cut to help things?

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